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River Fishing >> Goverment & Science and Fisheries Management  

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fishguidebrian
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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: superfly]
      #284823 - 04/12/07 05:28 AM

Maybe it's time we change the commmitee? Three years and nothing? I'm not pointing ANY fingers but times need to change, not just the commmittee but the whole thing at Fish and Wildlife....

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AuntyM
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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: fishguidebrian]
      #284832 - 04/12/07 06:30 AM

I don't think that's the answer at all Brian. Getting rid of dedicated hard workers and replacing them with easily manipulated newbies is NOT a good idea IMO. I have faith in the guys I know on this committee and I appreciate the heck out of them.

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Fishhead5
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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: AuntyM]
      #284937 - 04/12/07 01:34 PM

Brian, if you knew how many hours they put in, not only at meetings, but of their own time, talking to people, and doing research, you wouldn't be spouting off so much. Have you once called any of them, asked if they needed any help? (by the way, I am pointing a finger)

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It is not illegal to deplete a fishery by management.







Edited by Fishhead5 (04/12/07 01:39 PM)


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fishguidebrian
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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: Fishhead5]
      #284947 - 04/12/07 02:09 PM

Doug, I also have put in a TON of time on Chehalis issues such as the tribe wanting the river closed through the reservation and the netting scedule of the Quinaults thats gonna put a hurtin on th late run of fish. I go to a majority of the meetings, I'm involved with the guides association,and nwo teh CCA. I work with Enforcement on issues down there with poaching and illegal harvest and lately I've had to move about 500lbs of trash and metal on my own time and at my own expense out of several places that I fish! So now the fingers being pointed back at ya!

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Fishhead5
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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: fishguidebrian]
      #284952 - 04/12/07 02:19 PM

Should I bitch at you for the net schdule not being changed??

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AuntyM
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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: Fishhead5]
      #284955 - 04/12/07 02:26 PM

Touche Doug.

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fishguidebrian
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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: AuntyM]
      #284958 - 04/12/07 02:37 PM

Nah, we did mange to stop it from being 7 days a week like they wanted though!

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AuntyM
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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: fishguidebrian]
      #284961 - 04/12/07 02:43 PM

I don't really think attacking a group of advisors for doing their best helps matters AT ALL Brian. If their recommendations keep getting ignored year after year, it's time to do something different, and replacing them isn't it. Giving them our united support and taking our gripes to the commission should be the next step.

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fishguidebrian
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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: AuntyM]
      #284966 - 04/12/07 02:50 PM

It's not the group as a whole Marsha, it's a certain few on the group who have backdoored things, I talked with several VERY influential people about what went on down there.

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AuntyM
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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: fishguidebrian]
      #284971 - 04/12/07 03:04 PM

Why is everyone pussing footing around? WHO are the so called influential people? Put it out there and let me at em!

And if it went down the way Duane says, changing the membership on the advisory committee wouldn't make a dang bit of difference. However, the WDFW commission needs to hear our frustrations so they can at least attempt to address concerns in the future.

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Musicman
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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: AuntyM]
      #284980 - 04/12/07 03:29 PM

That is too funny AM....that was my thoughts, to a t! I realize that Brian probably can't name...names but, obviously we need a different attack..I'm just a reader, you guys know WAY more than I in the arena of "fishery management"...i'll support a winning agenda/team..just point me in the right direction!

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fishguidebrian
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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: Musicman]
      #284984 - 04/12/07 03:58 PM

I can name names, it just needs to come from an official source involved with the PFMC... not from me. I've spoken to a former comissioner and a PFMC board member as well as one of our lobbyists from the NSIA about it so their time is coming.....

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Foxtrotter
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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: fishguidebrian]
      #284990 - 04/12/07 04:41 PM

I'm not trying to create more work for anyone but I have a request that will likely help us all.

There are some of us who are very versed with the different groups involved with fisheries (mis)management and some that are not. I'm sure that many read these posts and see all these groups named with a bunch of abbreviations like FFMC, NoF, NSIA, CIA, THC, BIA, BATF, OPEC, etc and kind of get confused and then lose interest in what the heck is going on.

I wouldn't be the one to do it but perhaps someone could make a thread or a post that lists the various groups, who runs them, what they do, who they serve and which fisheries they have jurisdiction over and so forth.

That way more people would get educated, there would be more consensus and more participation in these issues and groups. And it would be a lot easier to inspire folks to get active if they understood what they were getting involved in.

My 2 cents

Foxtrotter

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fishdoc
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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: Foxtrotter]
      #284996 - 04/12/07 05:31 PM

Wrong names Brian...I don't believe anyone involved with PFMC has a direct hand in the craziness of the Chehalis.

Aunty, I don't believe that naming names will do any good. The two primaries are well rooted and well respected. Firefish and I did discuss today a plan that should be able to hold serious water in this process and circumvents the powers to be. Don't touch your remote!!

Doc

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fishguidebrian
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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: fishdoc]
      #285009 - 04/12/07 06:02 PM

Doc, these are the people who know the names, and were at the meeting! They w have no direct hand with the PFMC but do have spots on the commitee or influence there of.

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FireFish
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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: fishguidebrian]
      #285090 - 04/12/07 10:19 PM

Quote:

fishguidebrian said:
Nah, we did mange to stop it from being 7 days a week like they wanted though!



Brain, just so we all keep our facts straight, I too was concerned when I heard this rumor. And that's exactly what it was, a RUMOR. The Quinaults never approched WDFW stating that they where going to increase their Steelhead fishing this past winter to 7 days a week. So I would say you had no effect on this situation. Now as far as the other stuff you mentioned, I have seen you at one meeting and that was in Chehalis and it was about Mother Cow. If you have other things going on then great. Cleaning out areas on the Chehalis, because it's where you fish and it's in your way, is motivated by the fact it is in your area. Being involved on a level of commitment to a committee to try to affect change for all is where you try to make a difference. The other issue is that you do these things out of concern for our Fisheries for the betterment of all and don't go fishing for complements after stating how much work you do. There is a difference between Self Serving and Selfless-ness. I think you have the two confused...

FireFish Out...

--------------------


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1. Working to Unite Sporties to get Issues
Resolved...
2. Working Hard to Get Back Our 50% of the Bolt
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fishdoc
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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: FireFish]
      #285110 - 04/13/07 06:44 AM

I will march in here as I have now read this entire thread and must say this is nuts.

The most blatant show of ignorance is the statement by Brian that after three years maybe we need a new committee. Let me explain why. In working with WDFW on this issue it is literally all about numbers, right??. When you first start off not only are the numbers brain numbing they are 2 years old and then extrapolated in an attempt to make them work for today. For the most part the first year is one of wide eyed, brain popping, head shaking learning curves.

The second year is the one where you believe you have at least a quasi grasp on the numbers and once you do and can sound relatively intelligent in addressing them, WDFW starts pulling numbers out of hats that don't exist or at least you have never seen that hat. The feeling of being absolutely railroaded is common. Now the fun begins.

The third year normally finds you confident in the numbers, ready for that oncoming train to only find out that it really isn't about numbers or being derailed. You find out that there are higher beings, beyond your scope that are really controlling this fishery. Now the work really begins.

Year 4-10. You can talk the language, you can do the numbers in your sleep, there are no more trains, you have built strong working relations with some trusted WDFW folks and then...the people you have worked so hard with take a job in...Olympia...or Wenatchee or who knows. Now you are back to square one with someone who sees the numbers differently, who interprets the results differently, who has built new and different trains etc...

Reality is this: We all have a passion in this case for the Chehalis, motivated by different sources in our lives. We go to bed at times thinking about it, we wake up thinking about, we drive our spouses/friends nuts talking about it. The WDFW on the other hand has a job, he or she has been assigned the Chehalis. Its a job not a passion big difference!

Now onto the other big issue that I see prevalent in this thead and its easily enough addressed but I know after years and years of being in this fight let me just say this and primarily to Superfly and Fishguide Brian but to all of us to some extent.

CHECK YOU EGOS AND ATTITUDE AT THE DOOR THEY ARE IN THE WAY AND DETRIMENTAL IN ACCOMPLISHING THE ULTIMATE GOAL THAT WE ALL HAVE.

Enough said about that.

I may be wrong with this next statement but I don't think so. Many of us have joined the CCA and for good reason. However, I do not believe that the Chehalis or any other river not connected to the Columbia will get much attention for quite sometime. If the CCA can help win the battle on the Columbia others will fall in line and they are fully aware of that. They need our money and our support but don't get disheartened if they don't seem interested in our local passions.

So, in closing. Do we need a new committee?? No. Do we need new members on the committee? No. What we do need is a tact that gives us the upperhand in all that is the Grays Harbor Management issues. We all need to think outside the box...way outside the box. I believe we all need to be willing to not only have it cost us our time but our pocketbook as well. Most importantly, I believe that no single person should feel superior to any other person in this process. Every person, every contact, every network is vitally important in the long haul. Passions are extremely emotional and some of us are more vocal in our emotions, some of us tend to put people down when talking about our passions, some of us point fingers of blame when talking about our passions and some of us get quiet when dealing with our passions. We are all different not all wrong. I implore you to all think outside the box, come up with what you believe to be a potential solution, lets work together and quit this craziness.

You could say that I have known the Chehalis since before I was born. My family settled here in the early 1800's. Most of the piling that you see in her and along her banks were driven by my great uncles Tony and Pat. The first known sport caught sturgeon in the Chehalis was by my uncle Pat...it made the news. My first salmon, steelhead, dolly, sea run, whitefish, squawfish, sturgeon, duck, goose, deer, elk, bear all came from her or along her shores. This is my passion pure and simple, lets git 'er done!

This has been, I am sure my longest post ever and I am impressed if you read it in its entirety. If you have some thoughts that you want to share privately...feel free to email me or call me at: 360.520.1175

There is so much more to this subject, this is just a scratch but you know what they say...if you have an itch...


Sincerely..............Doc

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AuntyM
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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: fishdoc]
      #285120 - 04/13/07 08:02 AM

I can agree more or less with what you wrote there except
Quote:

I may be wrong with this next statement but I don't think so. Many of us have joined the CCA and for good reason. However, I do not believe that the Chehalis or any other river not connected to the Columbia will get much attention for quite sometime. If the CCA can help win the battle on the Columbia others will fall in line and they are fully aware of that. They need our money and our support but don't get disheartened if they don't seem interested in our local passions.





I don't believe that to be the case, based on Gary Loomis's joining of the PS Chinook lawsuit prior to his bringing CCA to the NW. He has stated time and again, his desire that commercial harvest practices be changed and if the experts at CCA review what is happening on the Chehalis, I think they will find more than enough justification to become involved. Not to mention how many people concerned with the Chehalis basin have become members. My understanding is, the members will be involved in the decision making process, therefore, we should be able to get CCA involved with the Chehalis.

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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: AuntyM]
      #285124 - 04/13/07 08:26 AM

Well said Jim, your passion shows through...that's some family history you have surrounding the river....

"This is my passion pure and simple, lets git 'er done!"



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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: Musicman]
      #285135 - 04/13/07 09:19 AM

AMEN BROTHA DUANE AND BROTHA DOUG !!!

And Aunty M I love you too and yes I have joined CCA, they did alot of work where I like to fish down in Florida and have made the difference, lets see what they can do here.

Peace
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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: superfly]
      #285139 - 04/13/07 09:26 AM

Doc,
I have no problem with my Ego , but when someone attacks me personally about something they no nothing about, then I am going to fire back, especially when the individual has or claims to have knowledge or claims to have been there and they were not.

Simply put, I will not tolerate a Poser hammering on me!!
Other than that I am all for mass cooperation and thinking way outside the Box.

Peace
Superfly

--------------------
www.superflysfishing.com[/url]

2/23 4th BDE 2 ID Good Job !!!

Now Booking for: Winter Steelhead & Late Coho

I'm like sprint or Motorola no Service out of your range !!!!

Member Grays Harbor Salmon ManagementCommittee


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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: superfly]
      #285155 - 04/13/07 11:28 AM

I understand Fly and I hope that you realize that I am 100% behind what you guys are doing. I also know how incredibly frustrating it is to work as hard as you guys have and have WDFW throw it back in your face. Have a chat with Firefish about what we discussed and then get back to me...might be time then to chat on the phone, I will need your help.

Aunty...I hope, I hope, I hope you are right and if thats all we can find to disagree on then we are moving in the right direction!!

Doc

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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: fishdoc]
      #285177 - 04/13/07 01:12 PM

So true Jim/AM...splittin hairs..."the right direction"...

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JD


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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: Musicman]
      #285190 - 04/13/07 02:28 PM

I just love it when the truth really comes out!

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AuntyM
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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: Fishhead5]
      #285193 - 04/13/07 02:59 PM

Quote:

I just love it when the truth really comes out!





Quote:

Aunty M I love you




I wish I'd known that BEFORE you married Dawn!



--------------------
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The Monster Breathes!

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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: Foxtrotter]
      #285216 - 04/13/07 05:39 PM

hello ????

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Re: Chehalis EMERGENCY! new [Re: Foxtrotter]
      #285221 - 04/13/07 06:23 PM

It's a joke.

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